Comments on: Sir Tim Berners-Lee: Thanks for Giving Birth to the Web, but it’s all Grown-up Now, kthxbye

By: Wisdom of the Crowds Isn’t the Answer for Everything « kNow Media

Wisdom of the Crowds Isn’t the Answer for Everything « kNow Media — Wed, 17 Sep 2008 14:14:55 +0000

[...] at. There are some serious problems with that assumption, but perhaps even more problematic was the dismissal provided by Andy Beal over at Marketing Pilgrim today (emphasis added): Do I have to keep repeating myself on this [...]

By: Search Engine News » Sir Tim Berners-Lee: Thanks for Giving Birth to the Web, but its all Grown-up Now, kthxbye

Wed, 17 Sep 2008 09:06:41 +0000

[...] More from http://www.marketingpilgrim.com…; [...]

By: maruschka

maruschka — Tue, 16 Sep 2008 15:13:31 +0000

@ SIMB
“Doesn’t matter if he did, because the fact is that sometimes the general public is not educated enough to make the right decision.”

That benevolent dictator, paternalistic attitude is an elitist view of “the general public” that I don’t subscribe to.

But to get back to the topic Andy is discussing today, a rating system for websites to somehow rank their “trustworthiness” is a baby step away from censorship, in my opinion. How quickly would we move from saying that a site isn’t trustworthy to burying it or banning it? Who decides? What is the criteria?

Andy’s examples of trusted sites that made big mistakes with information should give all of us pause. The opposite can also be true – a site with a questionable reputation may also have factual, provable true content.

Caveat emptor.

By: Joe Hall

Joe Hall — Tue, 16 Sep 2008 14:36:55 +0000

I want to apologize for calling Howard blind it is his right to his own opinion. I think essentially what this conversation has turned into is a debate about direct democracy versus representative democracy. I for one prefer representative democracy versus direct, for many of the reasons that SIMB pointed out. However, I also believe that the current representative democracy that we live with here in the US isn't very representative at all. But I think its more important to get back on topic and talk about this whole idea of developing a system of "trustworthiness" that Lee is talking about. I personally think that the web is already doing that in many ways. take a look at sites like digg and sphinn where users vote on content, in a way they are creating systems where authenticity can be created. And then of course we can look at Google, where despite the fact that many might find hypocrisies in their business practices, they do a great job filtering most of the muck from their index, and they are getting much better at it. So, I would argue that the natural progression of the web will automatically create this system of "trustworthiness", that Lee is referring to. Joe Hall's last blog post..Bloggers deserve real tips not stolen goods!

By: Andy Beal

Andy Beal — Tue, 16 Sep 2008 14:21:19 +0000

@SIMB – we’re not talking about the wisdom of one–which is your example. Also, this is the “wisdom” of crowds, not the “scientific knowledge.”

By: SIMB

SIMB — Tue, 16 Sep 2008 14:07:49 +0000

“Didn’t Hitler say that first?”

Doesn’t matter if he did, because the fact is that sometimes the general public is not educated enough to make the right decision. Ask the average Joe what a stem cell is and see what reaction you get. Can people that are not educated on topics really make good decisions about them?

By: maruschka

maruschka — Tue, 16 Sep 2008 13:32:49 +0000

@ father_time
“The masses can’t be trusted to make good choices”
Didn’t Hitler say that first?

By: Andy Beal

Andy Beal — Tue, 16 Sep 2008 13:22:29 +0000

@Father_time – but if that is what the masses want, why should one person–or group–tell the masses otherwise? History is littered with individuals that wanted to tell the masses what is good for them.

By: Andrew Chapman

Andrew Chapman — Tue, 16 Sep 2008 11:42:45 +0000

An answer to this is already being realised as we speak. Check out Rowdii www dot rowdii dot com. Rowdii allows the public to write comments about any website (and the company/service the website represents). Rowdii also allows people to create links from one site to another, thereby creating a network of valuable related resources. Check it out.

By: father_time

father_time — Tue, 16 Sep 2008 08:54:03 +0000

The trouble with letting the masses decide is that when left to their own devices the masses choose junk food, TV and to re-elect George Bush.

The masses can’t be trusted to make good choices as the majority of them are ill equipped to make informed decisions.

I have thought for a long time that an ‘expert web’ would be an wonderful thing. Rather than relying on the rubbish that you get from wikipedia for 70% of your queries, wouldn’t it be great to be able to find the wisdom of true experts in their chosen field.

By: Wisdom of the Crowds Isn’t the Answer for Everything | Internet Startups

Wisdom of the Crowds Isn’t the Answer for Everything | Internet Startups — Tue, 16 Sep 2008 05:28:44 +0000

By: Wisdom of the Crowds Isn’t the Answer for Everything »TechAddress

Wisdom of the Crowds Isn’t the Answer for Everything »TechAddress — Tue, 16 Sep 2008 04:43:18 +0000

[...] at. There are some serious problems with that assumption, but perhaps even more problematic was the dismissal provided by Andy Beal over at Marketing Pilgrim today (emphasis [...]

By: Wisdom of the Crowds Isn’t the Answer for Everything - Mashable

Wisdom of the Crowds Isn’t the Answer for Everything - Mashable — Tue, 16 Sep 2008 04:00:11 +0000

By: AV Flox

AV Flox — Mon, 15 Sep 2008 18:15:59 +0000

I'm in complete accord, Andy. I'll admit to a bit of crowd angst myself, but eventually we learn to trust the web's invisible hands. The road to hell is paved with knee-jerk reactions and that's exactly what this system of trustworthiness labels sounds like. AV Flox's last blog post..Old Media's Foray Into New Media: A Cautionary Tale

By: Howard Keziah

Howard Keziah — Mon, 15 Sep 2008 18:07:35 +0000

@Joe, pointing me to reading on open source or web 2.0 doesn’t tell me crowds invent anything. Sure they collaborate and expand but I still don’t know of an invention by “crowds”.

And next time why not try contributing something in your response instead of an ad hominem response. I’m not blind and I read widely. Geez.

By: Utah SEO Pro

Utah SEO Pro — Mon, 15 Sep 2008 17:04:48 +0000

Conceptually, he has good stances. It's feasibility that's another thing. Utah SEO Pro's last blog post..Building an SEO Friendly Site - SES San Jose 2008 Presentation

By: Andy Beal

Andy Beal — Mon, 15 Sep 2008 16:06:42 +0000

@Howard – he’s certainly allowed his opinion – I always respect opinions. I’ve just added my own.

By: Joe Hall

Joe Hall — Mon, 15 Sep 2008 15:58:35 +0000

"I have yet to see crowds invent anything." @Howard are you blind????? Try doing some reading on open source or web 2.0 or hell just go and read a blog or forum....geez Joe Hall's last blog post..Bloggers deserve real tips not stolen goods!

By: Howard Keziah

Howard Keziah — Mon, 15 Sep 2008 15:54:21 +0000

I happen to agree with Tim. And his role is fulfilled? What? He’s not allowed his opinion, or to further contribute? I have yet to see crowds invent anything.

By: Joe Hall

Joe Hall — Mon, 15 Sep 2008 14:45:50 +0000

Its important to remember that his major contribution was made during a time when the current magnitude of the internet was inconceivable. He is now looking at things with that perspective. Joe Hall's last blog post..Bloggers deserve real tips not stolen goods!